After the last days of Barrow Road

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jules
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After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by jules »

I found some old photos of Barrow Road / St Philips taken in 1969 - pretty depressing sights though.

Full set here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/50649078@N ... 323287777/

Let me know if you want the originals for here Hattie. Apologies for quality - published more for historic content rather than photographic qualities. An example - Site of St Philips Station:

Image
Marsh'Un
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After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by Marsh'Un »

Jules

The image of Digby Street is superb.
The right hand side of the street contained an empty plot from where an excellent view of the 82E engine sidings could be obtained.
I well remember seeing a very clean 45608 `Gibraltar` from this spot.

Incidentally. the Kelly`s directory of 1964 lists No. 94 Barrow Road as a
Grocers shop belonging to a Mrs Annie Marie Field. The opposite corner was occupied by a Co-Op.
the green mile
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Post by the green mile »

I lived in no.81 almost opposite the Coop and a few doors away from the Forgemans Arms. My Aunt Lil lived in Digby St and the rest of the family within a mile. I'd give my right arm to turn the clock back 50 years.
Last edited by the green mile on Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jules
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Post by jules »

The image of Digby Street is superb.
Thank you for your compliments :D

As this is Bristol Railway Archive, I'll tell you how I did it. I first spotted Digby Street amongst some of Fray Bentos's excellent 1970s images of Bristol on Flickr and got interested in the street from those. I wondered if it would be possible to find any more images as the street (and the tall houses) were, to say the least impressive, especially for Barton Hill.

A little research showed up that Bristol City Records office had a photograph entitled "Junction of Digby Street and Barrow Road - 1969". So, I went down there with camera and took a photograph of the photograph. The original photograph was in a pack of many, all taken by a British Rail photographer - no doubt in advance of their selling off the land. Why he took a photo of Digby Street I don't know - perhaps just to record it for posterity, so the pictures of a derelict Barrow Road depot, which I wasn't at all expecting to find, were an added bonus. I photographed them all, with varying degrees of success, as the images show.

When I was much younger, I must have passed the end of Digby Street on many occasions, on the way to visit an elderly Aunt in Broomhill, but never really noticed it. My mother used to take me on the no 16 or 36 bus, both of which ran along Barrow Road and across the arches. I remember it being a wonderful sight for a small boy, to look from the top deck of a bus across the vast expanse of railway land. I must have seen the shed in its final working days as well as on many occasions afterwards.

Those houses in Digby Street would no doubt be highly desirable properties nowadays, if the whole area had not been decimated - and for what? Bristol City Council had a lot to answer for in the 1960s all in the name of so called "progress".
I lived in no.81 almost opposite the Coop and a few doors away from the Forgemans Arms. My Aunt Lil lived in Digby St and the rest of the fanily within a mile. I'd give my right arm to turn the clock back 50 years.
Ah, The Forgeman's Arms - a sad and still recent loss, demolished in 2009. (See here http://bristolslostpubs.eu/page260.html) Sadly, I remember passing the place many times, but never once ventured in for a beer as far as I can recall. During the final days, it was renamed the Forge Inn and was even offering Bed & Breakfast to try and keep going.

I'd be interested to hear any further memories of Digby Street / Barrow Road - research suggests a lot of railway staff lived there. What was your Aunt Lil's surname and what number did she live at?
Incidentally. the Kelly`s directory of 1964 lists No. 94 Barrow Road as a Grocers shop belonging to a Mrs Annie Marie Field.
Fascinating. Another little detail from the past there. Keep them coming please and I'll build as much a picture of the place as I can ... I've also discovered that the building behind the Co-op was a bakehouse?

If you've not seen Fray's images, this one has a particularly poignant tale attached and many interesting comments:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fray_bentos/3798188864/
trafalgar45682
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Barrow Road and Digby Street

Post by trafalgar45682 »

I took a number of shots of trains on the main line from Digby Street, including this one of 45569.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/bristolsteam/5743046332/

and 44753 with its ecs on the same day in November 1963

http://www.flickr.com/photos/bristolste ... 5157165429

I believe some of the houses were derelict at this time and I went into one of the back gardens

Long after the shed shut, I went back and took these two photo's while the arches were still in place, dated to about 1986/87


http://www.flickr.com/photos/bristolste ... 5157165429


http://www.flickr.com/photos/bristolste ... 5157165429

There are some other very interesting pictures on Flickr of the site after closure from Fray Bentos and other contributors
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Post by Robin Summerhill »

jules wrote: Those houses in Digby Street would no doubt be highly desirable properties nowadays, if the whole area had not been decimated - and for what? Bristol City Council had a lot to answer for in the 1960s all in the name of so called "progress".

On this, I must comment but wander off topic.

Local councils had a major problem with insanitary conditions, especially (but not exclusively) in the towns and cities. Starting in the 1930s, and interrupted by the war, Sanitary Inspectors were employed to visit each and every property to establish the condition of the property and the level of overcrowding. This was the origin of the Slum Clearance programmes that were going on all over the country post-war (and to a lesser extent before it)

Jules - you say you've been to the Records Office - go again and look at the minutes of the Housing and Health Committees and see the sort of things that were going on, especially the Chief Medical Officer of Health's regular reports about the outbreaks of such diseases as smallpox, diptheria, TB and the like, many of which were exacerbated by these insanitary and overcrowded conditions.

Bristol, in common with many other Councils, were charged with addressing these issues. The way they did it (which in the case of Barton Hill/ St Phillips was to put up high rise blocks of flats for some, and move the rest to such places as Stockwood and Hartcliffe) could be argued against with the benefit of hindsight (a bit like the Beeching closure programme) but, at the time, it was seen as the modern way ahead.

I too had an aunt in the area; she lived in Lincoln Street, backing onto the GWR line. The house was freezing cold, riddled with damp, full of structural defects, and she was as happy as Larry when they pulled it down and put her in a flat in Eccleston House ;)
jules wrote: I'd be interested to hear any further memories of Digby Street / Barrow Road - research suggests a lot of railway staff lived there.
Of course they did. People generally lived much closer to their work in those days. That's why the "knocker up" at Barrow Road could do his job - he didn't have to ride his bike that far :)
jules
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Post by jules »

Bristol, in common with many other Councils, were charged with addressing these issues. The way they did it (which in the case of Barton Hill/ St Phillips was to put up high rise blocks of flats for some, and move the rest to such places as Stockwood and Hartcliffe) could be argued against with the benefit of hindsight (a bit like the Beeching closure programme) but, at the time, it was seen as the modern way ahead.
I too know the issues of the time, but I think the powers that be overlooked - or had no inkling, of the social impact the mass re-locations had. For many years, I lived on Stapleton Road and worked the local bars, particularly around St Judes (The Swan with Two Necks, The Waggon & Horses etc). Unbelievably, 70 years on after St Judes was cleared, people would still return from places like Hartcliffe on a Saturday night for the regular "knees up" or for a Sunday lunch time drink. Despite being children when they were moved out, they still had strong ties to the area and to their former neighbours, as did their parents. Even their own children and grand children still came, suggesting it was an inter-generational thing, though I admit it seems to be finally dying out over these last ten years.

I have heard many stories of people feeling totally "lost" in the wildernesses of Hartcliffe, Southmead and the other estates. No amenities, in some cases little better than mud roads, unknown neighbours - but a decent house, with a garden and a tempramental Ascot water heater at best! And no pub on the street corner ... plus a new, long and expensive bus ride to work or to the shops.

Alas, it is easy to look back with rose-tinted glasses at where we have come from and times were, of course, far harder than they are now. It might have been done to alleviate chronic overcrowding and insanitary conditions (generally down to lack of investment and greed by money grabbing private landlords, featuring prominently the church), but I believe the 1930s-60s slum clearances were done with several major failings:

1. The alternative "tower block" was no way to live, especially with a family. It was viewed as "cheap, compartmentalized living" for the working classes and as a housing solution, it utterly failed and still does. That's why they're being knocked down ...

2. The re-housing was done almost as a military operation, without consideration of the undoubtedly strong social fabric that was being torn apart.

3. And the one I believe to be the biggest failure, particularly in Bristol, was the planners' vision of the future where the private car was to reign supreme above all. Huge swathes of the city and its older housing demolished purely for road schemes, as the planners revelled in the idea that everyone would have a car and they would be free to sweep through the city unimpeded by any obstruction, such as pedestrians or streets with shops and houses (see Lawrence Hill Roundabout, Easton Way, the M32 for example).
I too had an aunt in the area; she lived in Lincoln Street, backing onto the GWR line. The house was freezing cold, riddled with damp, full of structural defects, and she was as happy as Larry when they pulled it down and put her in a flat in Eccleston House
No doubt she was :wink: But how did she feel ten years, twenty tears on? Back in the 1990s, the Council ran a programme called "Neighborhood Renewal" in Easton. It did an awful lot for the old Victorian houses that escaped the destruction of the 1930s - 60s, just showing that there was an alternative to the clearance programmes - and a viable one too. My enduring belief is that mass clearance was a two-pronged political agenda, driven by the obsession of sweeping away everything old and the desire for a space aged style city infested with zooming private cars.

Maybe that was desirable from their perspective back then - but to me it will always be a short-sighted, destructive mistake. Both in architectural and social terms.
jules
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Post by jules »

I took a number of shots of trains on the main line from Digby Street, including this one of 45569.
Seen all of those before, of course. Thanks for making them public :D

Were the houses in Digby Street really going derelict as early as 1963?
Robin Summerhill
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Post by Robin Summerhill »

jules wrote: 1. The alternative "tower block" was no way to live, especially with a family. It was viewed as "cheap, compartmentalized living" for the working classes and as a housing solution, it utterly failed and still does. That's why they're being knocked down ...
I certainly hope that I didn't come over as a supporter of tower blocks - I certainly wasn't trying to :)

But you have to remember that one of the major problems that surrounded this was the fact that the British do tend to like their houses and gardens, All over Europe at the time, other nations were finding their populations more than happy in high-rise flats with central heating and all mod-cons. It didn't work in the UK, but I don't honestly think that you could blame Bristol Corporation is isolation - all major local authorities were doing it all over the country (and it didn't work in their areas either!) :)
Jules wrote: 3. And the one I believe to be the biggest failure, particularly in Bristol, was the planners' vision of the future where the private car was to reign supreme above all. Huge swathes of the city and its older housing demolished purely for road schemes, as the planners revelled in the idea that everyone would have a car and they would be free to sweep through the city unimpeded by any obstruction, such as pedestrians or streets with shops and houses (see Lawrence Hill Roundabout, Easton Way, the M32 for example).
I can't argue with any of that, except to point out that,, once again, it wasn't just in Bristol - it was happening all over the country. Birmingham, Sheffield and Manchester spring immediately to mind as worse example than Bristol.

It was of course far worse when huge swathes of properties were demolished for roads that never came - I'm thinking especially of Totterdown.
jules wrote:
Robin Summerhill wrote:I too had an aunt in the area; she lived in Lincoln Street, backing onto the GWR line. The house was freezing cold, riddled with damp, full of structural defects, and she was as happy as Larry when they pulled it down and put her in a flat in Eccleston House
No doubt she was :wink: But how did she feel ten years, twenty tears on?
As it happened, she stayed happy in Eccleston House until her early 80s (that would have been late 1970s) when, having problems with getting up the stairs (she was on the second floor), she got a bungalow in St George. Lived happily out there until she was 92! :)

(Oh, and by the way, I missed a word out in my original post - she was a great aunt, not an aunt - I'm not quite that old to have a sister of my mother born in the 19th century!!)
Marsh'Un
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After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by Marsh'Un »

Returning to the `64 Kelly`s directory, 25 houses in Digby St were still occupied at this time.
With reference to the earlier comments from "Green Mile", no less than 3 Lll`s are listed - Surnames Coles, Adderley & Stych.

Without wishing to add to the stimulating debate on the social issues of the time, communities were certainly a lot more self-contained than nowdays e.g .on the stretch of Barrow Road between Days Rd corner and Digby Steet could be found a boot repairer, ladies hairdresser, confectioner, fruit & veg shop, post office, draper, greengrocer, watch repairer and grocer.

Wish I had my own Tardis.....
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Re: After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by Robin Summerhill »

Marsh'Un wrote: Without wishing to add to the stimulating debate on the social issues of the time, communities were certainly a lot more self-contained than nowdays e.g .on the stretch of Barrow Road between Days Rd corner and Digby Steet could be found a boot repairer, ladies hairdresser, confectioner, fruit & veg shop, post office, draper, greengrocer, watch repairer and grocer.

Wish I had my own Tardis.....
It was the same everywhere, and mainly because most people didn't have cars, and big supermarkets, let alone out of town shopping malls, had yet to come. Even such things as refrigerators were only just becoming commonplace when I was a kid - anybody else remember the "meat safe" on a shaded wall outside the back door? ;)

I have frequently told (disbelieving) members of younger generations how I, in my pre-school days, went shopping with my mother in Staple Hill High Street virtually every day. She had her shopping bag and, what she couldn't get in it one day would have to wait to the next to get purchased.
the green mile
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Post by the green mile »

Aunt Lil's surname was Bowden and I believe she lived in no.10 which was not on the side which backed out onto the railway. One of her sisters was Nellie Slade who lived in Lincoln Street. (There were 13 siblings, mostly girls - their maiden name being Fear). One of the brothers lived in Cobden St, not that far away. Rather poignantly this weekend, one was a Royal Marine who was lost at Dunkerque and another went down with the Hood.

All of those still living in the area during the 60's ended up in the tower blocks. My uncle Bob still lives in one, his local now being the Rhubard Tavern, which gave its name to the Rhubarb Curve between Dr Days and North Somerset Junction.
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Post by the green mile »

Thinking back, Aunt Lil's name was Adderley. We always referred to as a Bowden. I reckon she must have been widowed twice.

I was born in City Road, St Pauls. As a family of 4 living in 2 rooms, we qualified for a council house at Lockleaze but the isolation contributed to mental health problems for my mother. She ended up in Barrow Gurney hospital for lengthy periods which is how I ended up living with my grandparents in Barrow Road.
Marsh'Un
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After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by Marsh'Un »

Almost spot-on; Lily A Adderley was living at No. 12 Digby Street.

In the steam era, I lived in a prefab in Averay Road (alongside the Merchants Arms/Hungry Horse) at the bottom of Bell Hill, Stapleton.
The only form of heating was a coal fire and 2 portable paraffin heaters.
Needless to say, I have some very cold memories of winter 1962/63 !!
One consolation was lying in bed at night and hearing the Stapleton Rd banking engines "whistling up".
Also, during winter months with the leafless trees in Eastville park, we could see as well as hear engines on the Clifton Extension line.

Your earlier mention of the Rhubarb Tavern reminded me of the well-worn route from Barrow Road to St Phillips Marsh.
Up the steps from the shed yard,turn right past Barrow Rd shops and the entrance to Days Road.
Turn right again into Jarvis St, passing the technical school on the left and further down on the right, the Eldorado Ice cream factory.
Another right turn into Queen Ann Road, past the Rhubarb Tavern towards Silverthorne Lane.
Throught the arch (tunnel ?) underneath the railway lines, invariably seeing a D3oxx shunter and guards van passing overhead.
Past the road entrance to Kingsland Road sidings and Curtis`s scrap yard , then a left turn along the lane leading to the green footbridge over the Feeder Canal.
Down the steps at the far end, with the Perseverance pub on the opposite corner.
Along the Feeder, left into Short Street.
In the distance, the magical sight of a line on engines in steam on one of the bridges over Albert Crescent.
Pace quickening, on past Tiny`s transport cafe (with tethered goat in the field behind ).
Underneath the aforementioned railway bridges (3 of them ?).
Heart full of expectation, you eagerly ascend the steps to reach the shed yard.
To be ejected by an over-zealous Shed foreman.........
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Re: After the last days of Barrow Road

Post by Robin Summerhill »

Marsh'Un wrote:Your earlier mention of the Rhubarb Tavern reminded me of the well-worn route from Barrow Road to St Phillips Marsh.

.....

Underneath the aforementioned railway bridges (3 of them ?).
Heart full of expectation, you eagerly ascend the steps to reach the shed yard.
To be ejected by an over-zealous Shed foreman.........
I don't ever remember being slung out of any Bristol depot - I beat the odd hasty retreat from Bath Road as I recall, after going over the wall at the back, but never actually slung out.

What are other people's experiences?
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