Mangotsfield station plans

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Robin Summerhill
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Mangotsfield station plans

Post by Robin Summerhill »

Does anybody know whether there is an architectural plan of Mangotsfield station out there somewhere?

The reason I ask is that I have been looking at a number of old photographs of the station recently, and they don't exactly tie up to my recollections of it from the early 1960s. Specifically, the extent of the office/ staff quarters and the position of stationmasters house in the grounds.

Obvious places to look would be the internet (got nowhere fast looking there :) ), Kew Archives, NRM York and South Gloucestershire Records office, but I'm hoping that someone can shorten my search by pointing me in a productive direction
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horace
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Post by horace »

Robin, i can remember posting a request very similar to this way back in the distant past, i was after the track layout as the 25" OS sheets i have date from about 1914 and did not show the layout as i remember it. It did at one time have a copy of the 1957 25" to the mile sheet of Mangotsfield that showed rather a lot but i lent it to somebody whom then denied all knowledge of it.
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Blackthorn
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Post by Blackthorn »

The book 'An Historical Survey of the Midland In Gloucestershire' by Peter Smith has a section in it on Mangotsfield. There are track plans and some drawings etc. but I can't seem to lay my hands on my copy at the moment :(

If it turns up fairly soon I'll let you know exactly what's there.
Blandford1969
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What sort of plans?

Post by Blandford1969 »

What sort of plans are you looking for?

As has already been said the Midland in Gloucestershire is excellent for the layout plan (though nothing of the main buildings), there are also layout plans in the Middleton press books on Glous to Bristol and Bath to Bristol.

If you are looking for architectural plans I suspect that will be harder. You could try the public record office, although unfortunatley not many railway plans for England got there. You could try the Midland Society and also Somerset council.

Failing that if you want such plans, then you will need decent photos of all angles of the station. A quick flick through the web and books shows there is enough detail in photos to make a start. You can get window heights from the remaining walls. Although remember that looking at the photos the windows at the tip of the apex are narrower?,

From the areial photos it looks like the foundations of the walls that are demolished still exist so you could measure all the dimensions which will give the door locations and window locations on the remaining buildings. By measuring the dimensions of stones, it is then possible to start to make some good probable dimensions of the parts which are photographed but no longer survive.

The challenge as with many stations is what the rear of the buildings looked like. I go out of my way to buy these sorts of photos and negs as they are so useful. You could also e mail the various societies to see if they have anything. For example the S&D trust and LSWR society have not long had a collection of negs from a chap (name escapes me) who took more unusual views and rears of buildings. I do not know if he went to Mangotsfield though. I cannot remember seeing any plans of Mangotsfield when I looked in their archive many years ago, but that does not mean they ahev not (they have full plans for Templecombe, Parkstone and Bournemouth West as examples of non line stations)

For the waiting rooms on the two island platforms you can get the length from the main plan to get the footprint, then you just need a view that shows bricks or planks. Bricks being 3 x 9" and planks on railway buildings often being 6".

If there were sufficent photos and dimensions of the remains i would certainly be willing to have a go at doing plans of Mangotsfield. It may be that drawings can be made of the front of the building, but until photographic evidence or memories of the rear of the building are found that that is not possible. I have already done Blandford (now helping the museum build their model) Wincanton signal box and waiting shelter and I am currently working on Shillingstone before moving onto Wells. Unfortunatley I live in the Midlands and do not know when work will give me an excuse to take measurements.

Kind regards

Duncan
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Post by Robin Summerhill »

Blandford 1969 - that is a very impressive first post!

Let me fill in the background. This is purely out of historical interest (I am not trying to model it or something like that).

I knew Mangotsfield station well as a passenger (a teenage one!) during the last 5 years of its operation, but of course I was there to catch trains, or sometimes "spot" engines :wink: . I knew the platforms well, from the point of view of a passenger, and I have a clear recollection of the island platforms that concurs with photographs that I have seen in more recent years.

My query, as I said in my original post, relates to the staff buildings on the centre platforms. If your nickname means that you hail from Blandford then the next bit might not mean much to you, but:-

As you walked onto the Bath bound platform from the footpath at the eastern end of the station, there was a wall, behind which was the stationmaster's house and the garden to that property. The wall still remains today.

At the end of that wall, IIRC, the station buildings started, and there was a covered way which led from the Bath bound platform to the down main line platform. The entrance to the booking office was to the left off that passageway, and behind the booking office window would have been the booking clerk's office. There were also public conveniences on the down main line platform which must have formed part of this central building. Perhaps there was a Porters Room or some such - I can't remember.

At some point since the station closed and the track formation was turned into a cycle path, the buildings were first demolished and then later an almost triangular wall was built over part of the area formerly covered by the station buildings. However, this "ornamental" wall does not sit on the foundations of the original station building - that was larger, and this can be seen by the fact that remnants of the concrete floor tiles that I recall being the floor covering in the booking office being outside that triangle.

Furthermore, there is a photograph here http://commondatastorage.googleapis.com ... 371642.jpg which seems to suggest that the external wall facing towards Bristol was not in fact straight, but had a bay window in it. This area, between the station building at that end and the apex of the triangular part of the station, was not somewhere where I can recall the layout at all - not only was I more interested in the trains than the buildings at the time, but also as I recall it was usually choc-a-bloc with parcels barrows!

So, as I said, from a wholly personal historical interest point of view, my interest is in the layout of that central building. Now that I've written all that down, perhaps it might jog one or two memories and some information might start to come in!
Blandford1969
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Post by Blandford1969 »

Thanks Robin,


A very interesting post which makes sense, Have you seen this photo http://www.flickr.com/photos/rustysea/2983387063/ which I think shows the bay you are talking about facing Bristol?

For old maps that really show the development and changes at the station have a look at http://www.old-maps.co.uk/maps.html. Search on Mangotsfield and then you can centre yourself over the station. A good number of old maps come up look first at the 1888 map which shows not many buildings or canopies. By 1903 all the buildings you would remember are there. It also clearly shows the bay you talk about as in the first link.

Whilst I did not know the station, I was not born till after closure. Your description certainly brings it to life and explains allot of the features of the station. It may appear daft, but it would be worth jotting down what you do remember of the buildings as I am sure there must be modellers out there who would want to build the station, and memories such as yours would help bring such a model to life.

Out of curiosity you described alot of features, was the covered way all glass in the same style as the canopies? You also describe that the Booking office was accessed from this passageway, were there many doors / windows off it and were they the same style as on the platform at that end

I'm not from Blandford but spent 20 odd years researching the station there. Now I'm just starting on making architectural plans of Wells Priory Road (which I do hope to model, if I can find enough photos showing the detail to be able to make plans). Having said that I'm always looking for my next challenge and some how preparing plans and then being able to share them just brings the history to life, whilst helping others.

I will be fasinated to see what else comes from others.

Kind regards

Duncan
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Post by Robin Summerhill »

We must be careful that this does not turn into a two-person thread! :mrgreen:

Looking at the Google Earth image at an eye altitude of about 150m, the new "ornamental" wall probably covers most of the area of the former booking hall - it was certainly that shape. This would suggest to me, given my recollections, that the public conveniences would have been just to the north of the north wall of that structure. The buildings ran "flush" with the wall around the Station Masters quarters

One problem with industrial archeaology on this site is that some "erberts" from Sustrans decided some time ago that it would be a good idea to plant trees on the sites of each of the canopy supports. There were a lot of canopy supports on the station and consequently there are now a lot of trees, their roots playing havoc with what was there previously.

Certainly I have never been able to establish where the original foundations to the main staff buildings are, but perhaps I haven't looked closely enough.

I shall take the dog for a walk up there this afternoon and have yet another look :)
Blandford1969
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Mangotsfield Railway Circle

Post by Blandford1969 »

Hi Robin,
I came across a group, which I presume are now defunct called the Mangotsfield Railway Cirlce, their bulletins are held by the NRM, might that have something for you.

By the way you talked about the gents, were there gents on both the Bath and Gloucester platforms as I came across this photo which appears to show it on the Gloucester platforms.

Where was the water fountain located by the way?

Regards

Duncan
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horace
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Post by horace »

Just to add a third person to this thread, and as you both seem to be also looking at my pics on Flickr, i am Mao Zhu on Flickr, i will throw in what i can remember about good old mangydo station.
I will over the next few days try and write up what i remember about the place, somehwere there are photographs taken from the top of rodway hill both before and after closure, i will find them and post the links when i find them.
I will also if i get time scan the station section of the 1914 25" OS sheet which will give you an idea of the layout and post it on Flickr and post the link here.
Until then i wish you all the best with your searches.
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Re: Mangotsfield Railway Circle

Post by Robin Summerhill »

Blandford1969 wrote:
By the way you talked about the gents, were there gents on both the Bath and Gloucester platforms as I came across this photo which appears to show it on the Gloucester platforms.
You posted no link to the photograph you mention, but all I recall the only public conveniences were on the central platforms. Unless there is actually a sign describing them, I think you may have seen the stairway to the subway. Why (or if!) anybody ever used it is open to question - a dank, smelly place and there was a perfectly good public footpath which crossed the lines at the other end of the station.

The only buildings on the island platforms, IIRC, were timber-framed waiting shelters.

I don't recall the drinking fountain at all.

The 1:2500 scale 1915/16 OS map on Old Maps clearly shows the outline of the main station buildings on the centre platform, and confirms its unusual shape, together with a bay at the western end. So it has confirmed that, but then goes on to pose more questions than it answers! The stationmasters house is shown abutting the wall to the down main line platform, but what are the "bits and pieces" abutting the south western wall?

The dog was walked up there this afternoon and I did a little bit of research (the dog got bored with all the standing around :) ), but the difficulty is that without scraping away 40 years worth of accumulated soil it isn't easy to establish where the footings are (were). However, indentations in the soil and the extent of the remaining tarmac give an indication of where the external walls were. It appears that a bloody great tree has been planted on or about where the bay window was, so the exact tracing of the outline there was not possible.

I did notice the remains of a number of different-coloured floor tiles which would indicate different rooms within the building and, just in case anybody else is interested, a section of the gents urinal is still there! If you look at the station site in Google Earth at an eye altitude of about 150m, it appears as a white line running away from the northern face of the ornamental wall

(Edited for speelong misstooks)
Last edited by Robin Summerhill on Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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horace
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Post by horace »

The subways with gas lamps, the wooden waiting rooms, ahaa all coming back to me.

The tiles that are left are from the ticket hall if i remember correctly, which could be entered from the Bath or Gloucester side.

The one thing i do remember is that the station master had a garage for his car across the tracks adjacent to the little car park at the bottom of the access road.
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horace
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Post by horace »

In Ben Ashworths book "The last days of Steam In Gloucestershire" is a picture of Mangotsfield taken from Rodway Hill in 1982. The tracks are long gone, the ticket hall and canopies are gone. But showing behind the wall of the Gloucester down platform, the station masters house. Not a lot can be seen but it shows the way the roof was, the ridge of the roof was at 90 degrees to the platform wall. It also looks as if the house may still have been occupied as the garden is separated from the old knocked down station with what looks like a fence.
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Post by horace »

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Post by Blackthorn »

I still haven't found that book, but it doesn't sound like it has what you're looking for. Still annoying though! :evil:
Blandford1969
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Oops link attached

Post by Blandford1969 »

Sorry about that,

Here is the link to that photo http://www.flickr.com/photos/combomphot ... 30/sizes/l . I will have a look at Google earth. You can see why the subway was so dank lookinf at the remains, are the steps from the Bath Island platform still visible or have they been filled in now?

Hi Mao, look forward to seeing those images and hearing your memories of what the buildings looked like, can you remember what the rear of any of the buildings looked like or what that passageway and the entry into the Booking hall looked like?

The fountain http://www.flickr.com/photos/rustysea/2 ... 183391417/ I presume was on one of the walls of the booking hall now demolished.

The comment about the station masters house is interesting. Was the whole of that block the SM house? .

Will try to find that book on last days of steam. Of course what we really need is a nice areial photo from before the station was demolished, however they are very expensive to get hold of.

As for the buildings on that wall could they be parcels or porters?

Kind regards

Duncan
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