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Re: Railway terminology
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:28 am
by worthvalleyfitter
[quote="Robin Summerhill"]As it's been very quiet around here lately I thought I'd see if a discussion could be got going over the term "train station." I have to add that this is in direct response to a letter I've just read in a railway magazine penned by one of our illustrious BRA members in the far north, who apparently doesn't like the use of the term
.
The "northern bloke" wasn't me. I can see the logic behind "train station" as in bus station but it just ain't right.
After starting this off, Robin should henceforth be known as Which Tyler- the leader of the pedants' revolt. (I can't claim originality on that one unfortunately)
Had a good day on 82E's finest yesterday- the problem was how to stop the litle beggar steaming short of letting the fire go out!
A couple of drunken local intelligensia were walking up the line prompting a call from the bobby at Damems Jct who had been verbally, but fortunately not physically, abused when they climbed the stairs to his box. They were just stood in the portal of Mytholmes tunnel when I drew the train alongside and stopped with the brake directly opposite from which, to their surprise, a couple of rozzers jumped out and escorted them from the premises. I am sure that they are just the sort of types that would use the term "train station" if they were capable of stringing 2 words together so Railway Station it is, and shall remain!
Regards from oop north.
Re: Railway terminology
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:22 am
by Ian L Jamieson
worthvalleyfitter wrote: The "northern bloke" wasn't me.
That's because north doesn't stop at Wakefield. Ha! Ha!
Re: Railway terminology
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 12:37 pm
by Robin Summerhill
worthvalleyfitter wrote:
The "northern bloke" wasn't me.
.....
After starting this off, Robin should henceforth be known as Which Tyler- the leader of the pedants' revolt.
Ian L Jamieson wrote:worthvalleyfitter wrote: The "northern bloke" wasn't me.
That's because north doesn't stop at Wakefield. Ha! Ha!
Here we go then .....
It was Wat Tyler
I once watched a programme on TV where people were being asked where "up north" started, and it turned out that this very much depended on personal perspective.
To the likes of me, "up north" starts after you go over the Manchester ship canal on Thelwall viaduct on the M6, or passing the "Spinning Tower of Chesterfield" on the Midland main line.
Somebody from Penzance on the show I watched thought that "up north" started at Exeter ...
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 2:38 pm
by jules
Everyone knows it starts at Gloucester and always has, surely?
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:33 pm
by the green mile
Up North is anywhere above Wessex which isn't Wales. It is generally known as Mercia leading into Northumbria and beyond.
Thinking about my signalling training, I have come to the conclusion that signalling bell codes were probably one of the earliest forms of digital communication based on the binary system along with Morse Code. Which came first?
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:12 am
by Bill
I can only round out by having known someone from Wick in Scotland, where I found the expression of "going down south" was local talk in the town for going to their major shopping centre, which was Inverness. Anywhere else was mentioned by name.
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:40 am
by the green mile
With the East Coast Main Line being designated as going 'up' towards London, should that strictly be 'going up south' Or did this not apply beyond Edinburgh?
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:02 pm
by Ian L Jamieson
Another complication in the Highlands is that when someone mentions 'The South' then they could mean the Central Belt [Glasgow/Edinburgh corridor], they could mean further south in Scotland [Dumfries-shire, the Borders], or they could mean anywhere in England - so it means different things to different people!
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:21 pm
by buxton4472
I think it's at Laxford Bridge - an "important" road junction 20 miles south of Durness, Sutherland and therefore 20 miles south of the north coast of mainland Britain, that a road sign reads (left) A894 The South and (right) A838 (The North). Very precise!
Posted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:30 am
by Robin Summerhill
Bill wrote:I can only round out by having known someone from Wick in Scotland, where I found the expression of "going down south" was local talk in the town for going to their major shopping centre, which was Inverness. Anywhere else was mentioned by name.
Talking about Wick, I lodged there one night in May 1995 and went on to John O'Groats the following morning.
I was rather amused to see a signpost on leaving the town saying "A99 The North"
Wherever we think "up north" starts, there's certainly not much "up north" left by the time you get to Wick
Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 8:20 am
by Andrew
Ian L Jamieson wrote:jules wrote: Here's another one, from when I used to run the pub. About 2002, I started to notice people saying "Can I get a Fosters?" I used to say "Yes, of course you can. I get mine from Avonmouth" ...
They always looked rather perplexed until a regular explained that Jules only responds to "may I have" or "can I have" ... alas, so endemic now, I've given up the fight against both these examples of moronic, useless speech
Oh!, absolutely. I come very close to punching anyone I hear saying that sort of thing. I was always taught [Merrywood Boys] that one should avoid using the word 'get' if at all possible.
I feel rather responsible for this thread because RS started it following my letter to the Railway Magazine recently. My pedantry always lands me in hot water!
For most of my life (thanks to Cotham grammar!) one was "Bored WITH" something. Now the norm seems to be "Bored OF".
Also, if one enquires as to how someone is, the answer should be "Fine", "Very well" etc - not "Good" GRRR!
Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 8:35 pm
by railwest
I have come to the conclusion that signalling bell codes were probably one of the earliest forms of digital communication based on the binary system along with Morse Code...
Hmmm... a binary system has just two values/states, 0 and 1. Morse Code uses two values, a 'dot' (short) and a 'dash' (long). But railway bell codes???? Surely they have only one value/state, a 'ding' on a bell - the absence of a 'ding' is not part of the code. On the other hand, you could argue perhaps that in fact it was a trinary (?) system with three states - the 'ding', the 'short' pause between multiple 'dings' (eg when sending '4 bells') and the longer pause between groups of 'dings' (eg when sending '3-1').
Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:14 pm
by nickt
The double good seems to be developing popularity, hows things ? gooood - gooood and the original asker replies goodgood.
Just hearing some one ask how are you and the reply is "Im good" is annoying.
Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:26 pm
by BristleGWR
railwest wrote:the green mile wrote:I have come to the conclusion that signalling bell codes were probably one of the earliest forms of digital communication based on the binary system along with Morse Code...
Hmmm... a binary system has just two values/states, 0 and 1. Morse Code uses two values, a 'dot' (short) and a 'dash' (long). But railway bell codes???? Surely they have only one value/state, a 'ding' on a bell - the absence of a 'ding' is not part of the code. On the other hand, you could argue perhaps that in fact it was a trinary (?) system with three states - the 'ding', the 'short' pause between multiple 'dings' (eg when sending '4 bells') and the longer pause between groups of 'dings' (eg when sending '3-1').
A character in a computer system is defined by the value of a byte (which normally comprises of 8 bits). Binary serial transmission (i.e. communicating between two locations) is carried out by sending bits i.e. a series of 0's or 1's. A data frame is used to define the length of the start, stop and data bits for the transmission of a character.
This being the case I would personally define morse code as a binary serial transmission system, where dit's could be 1's, dah's could be 0's and the pauses the start/stop bits.
Likewise I would class bell codes as a binary serial transmission system, but in this case each ding would be a 1, and only the long pause between a series of dings would be a 0. Very long pauses between bell codes would be the start/stop bits.
Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:44 pm
by railwest
The 'problem' with bell codes is that everyone sends at different rates and how long is a long pause before you decide that is the 'stop bit' and not just a long pause? With binary data comms systems the electrical signals which represent the 0 or 1 bits are at defined lengths, and the data is sent in packets either of a pre-defined size or with a 'packet header' which includes the length of the packet. With bell codes, when you start to receive a code you have no idea how long that code will be or how many pauses - if any - it will include.