The Bristol Railway Archive

Yesterday I received (after purchasing on Ebay) a BR (LMR) working timetable for the Derby - Bristol route (and branches). If anyone is interested I have scanned from this and uploaded to Flickr the Summer 1954 working timetables for Mangotsfield to Bath Green Park and vice versa. The tables do not include timings at Mangotsfield North Jcn and so the only times for the expresses to the S&D from the Midlands and the North are those at Bath Green Park. One interesting detail concerns the 7:40 am and 4:52 pm locals from Bristol TM to Bath and the return workings. These are shown as Diesel worked. Presumably these must have been ex-GWR railcars even though the Bristol - Bath G.P. route was still under the auspices of the LMR at the time. Unless anyone has info to the contrary of course!

The links to the timetables are here ......
https://www.flickr.com/photos/galatea56 ... 101844388/
and
https://www.flickr.com/photos/galatea56 ... 101844388/

The timetables for the main line from Gloucester - Bristol make very interesting reading but because they form just a part of the whole Derby - Bristol route I intend over the next week to transcribe the relevant bits into Excel format for anyone who may like to browse them.

The reason for diesel workings to Bath GP is that these turns were worked by St PhillipÔÇÖs Marsh men.

It was a reciprocal arrangement whereby Bath GP men worked trains to Portishead. I presume it started after Nationalisation but perhaps somebody else knows for certain.

By the time I got interested in the working arrangements (late 1962 onwards) there was only one such working ÔÇô the 1710 or so ex BTM and 1825 or thereabouts back

So would that have meant Bath (Midland) based locos being used on Portishead locals? Or just the Bath crews?

.... and in the same working timetable almost by way of an addendum was the following ....

https://www.flickr.com/photos/galatea56 ... 101844388/

Summer Saturdays Loco Changes at St Philips Marsh
A handful of summer Saturday expresses originating in the West Country and bound for the Midlands and North East of England avoided Bristol Temple Meads station via the Bristol West to North Somerset Jcn link. Locos were changed at St Philips Marsh from WR to LMR types and the 1954 summer working timetable details the light engine movements from the LMR's Barrow Road shed to St Philips Marsh and shows the onward timings of the relevant expresses via Stapleton Rd and Westerleigh West Jcn to gain the ex-Midland route at Yate South Jcn.

buxton4472 wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 8:31 am So would that have meant Bath (Midland) based locos being used on Portishead locals? Or just the Bath crews?

I believe they were through workings with engine and crews. In the last few years the classes involved would have been the Ivatt class 2 and BR standard class 3 2-6-2Ts. At the time there were class 3s based at both Barrow Road abd St Phillips Marsh

Here is a compacted transcription of the Working Timetable for the Bristol Midland line for a typical August Saturday in 1951 which can be downloaded. It's in Excel format but you can print it out from the download if you so wish....

https://www.dalesman.net/rail/august-sa ... d-line.xls

I'll get round to transcribing the 1954 timetable in due course but it's a so-and-so to unravel!

buxton4472 wrote: Thu Nov 04, 2021 12:39 pm .... and in the same working timetable almost by way of an addendum was the following ....

https://www.flickr.com/photos/galatea56 ... 101844388/

Summer Saturdays Loco Changes at St Philips Marsh
A handful of summer Saturday expresses originating in the West Country and bound for the Midlands and North East of England avoided Bristol Temple Meads station via the Bristol West to North Somerset Jcn link. Locos were changed at St Philips Marsh from WR to LMR types and the 1954 summer working timetable details the light engine movements from the LMR's Barrow Road shed to St Philips Marsh and shows the onward timings of the relevant expresses via Stapleton Rd and Westerleigh West Jcn to gain the ex-Midland route at Yate South Jcn.

This was happening well into the 1960s too. I have heard tales from an ex-Barrow Road fireman that sometimes the engine changing point was Dr Days, although I am not sure where you would stop a train for an engine or crew change around there without fouling one or both juctions on the Rhubarb curve.

This was happening well into the 1960s too.

Yes - I do recall that. The difference in 1954 was that the LMR was still a very separate entity to the WR. This is I think borne out in the entries at Stoke Gifford which show crew changes there also. In reality these were probably just for dropping off a WR conductor since many Midland (Saltley or Bournville) crews may not have had route knowledge from North Somerset Jcn to Stoke Gifford. If they had crewed freight trains south from the Midlands the likelihood was that they were already familiar with the stretch from Yate South Jcn to Stoke Gifford where they would be relieved anyway. Only the northbound inter-regionals used the avoiding line. Was this to avoid to some extent the use of banking locos up to Fishponds? All southbound inter-regionals went via TM, with loco changes being made there.

I have heard tales from an ex-Barrow Road fireman that sometimes the engine changing point was Dr Days, although I am not sure where you would stop a train for an engine or crew change around there without fouling one or both juctions on the Rhubarb curve.

That does sound a bit unlikely to me, given the length of some of those summer Saturday expresses. Much better to do the change in the relative quiet of the avoiding line! Ten minutes for a loco change plus paths for the light engine movements could really snarl up traffic on either or both the Bath and Filton Jcn routes.

As promised, I am posting the working timetable transcript for a typical mid-August Saturday on the Midland line between Gloucester and Bristol in 1954 in Microsoft Excel. Just a few notes :
1) All times are in 24-hr format - the original timetable showed a.m./p.m times. 'Hal-minute' times have been rounded up.
2) The original timetable includes departure/arrival times for the Lydney rail motor at Berkeley Road. These have been excluded as not being appropriate to the main line.
3) The notes L and W in arrival/departure times refer to crew changes and water stops respectively
4) The whole table has been 'concertina-ed' to make it more readable and is presented in .xls format so making it readable by anyone irrespective of the edition of Excel they have. The whole down line and up line tables can be printed on two A4 sheets (If you've got good close vision!).
5) Being an LMR line at the time, there are no indications of times at or around Bristol for purely WR trains, all of which apart from the 10:35 ex Penzance were routed via Stapleton Rd and Westerleigh West Jcn.

Here is the download link :-

https://www.dalesman.net/rail/august-sa ... d-line.xls